Effective army for Machaka

[Schmoe]

After three demoralizing battles, I've come to the conclusion that I simply don't know how to put together an effective army. Does anyone have any tips as to what can be effective for Machaka?

Also, I've noticed my opponents have many, many mages and commanders equipped with Rods of Authority, etc in their armies. It's obviously effective, but I wonder how they are getting anywhere with research this way. Do the benefits (better firepower) outweigh the drawbacks (less research)? One of the most recent battles was against 18 enemy commanders and mages, 50 or so Ulm Infantry, and about 20 Black Knights of Ulm. My 40 living statues, 30-40 vine men and vine ogres, 10-20 hoplites, 4 black hunters, 4 witch doctors, 2 sorceresses, and a hoplite commander inflicted a grand total of 7 casualties and they were in turn slaughtered nearly to a man. I have some ideas, but I was hoping other people could chime in, as my ideas haven't proved too successful thus far.

[JJ_Colorado]

Hi,

I saw that battle because I had a scout in the province. The main thing that I noticed is that your arrows were basically ineffective. I recently fought a Machaka opponent who used wind guide (I think) and fire arrows (definitely) to great effect.

I also thought the living statues should have started a little farther forward and your spiders should have held back longer to let the Black Knights use up their lances on the living statues.

But, overall that Ulm army was just completely bad-*ss. I would not have wanted to face it. That army was SCARY. He had a LOT of Master Smiths casting LOTS of bladewinds, and he had over 20 black knights, and he had a lot of other wizards as well.

I think you might have wanted to mass your cavalry on one flank instead of putting part of it on each flank also. It was just bad luck that your black hunters ran straight into his knights.

That Ulm army is the best army in our game FYI. The only army close to it is the main Pythium army.

John

[Huzurdaddi]

After three demoralizing battles, I've come to the conclusion that I simply don't know how to put together an effective army. Does anyone have any tips as to what can be effective for Machaka?

The thing is that the game is in a pretty late stage. We are on turn 46. So magic and summons are starting to rule the battle field.

I would take a look at the following threads:

http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...4;t=000855;p=4

that's a really good one. Lots of super tricks in that one, maybe even a few you can use.

http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...;f=74;t=003077

is good as well. To be honest my late game sucks as well. I'll try to refine it in my next game.

[PvK]

A strong body of Hoplites can hold up against Ulm infantry. I use them as my Machakan backbone. Backing it are always a priest or more, casting Sermon of Courage (no magic required, and keeps the morale up). Include some cannon fodder to absorb some enemy effort. Include witch doctors and others - one or two to cast Blindness can be evil to elite enemies. Shortbows are very ineffective against Ulm, although with flame arrows they can be ok. Some protection spells can make your infantry even tougher, and good enough mass protection spells can even make your cheapo light infantry into fairly dangerous opponents.

A few (as many as you can afford, but at least 3 against anything tough) hunter spiders on one flank is good. Always good to have some vine ogres for meat shield, too. With sufficient numbers and good timing, Machakan armies can be very tough.

PvK

[Schmoe]

Well, it's good to know I'm not throwing away my best against his fodder. I think I may be able to beat it, I just wish I hadn't been premature and thrown 40 more (that's 80 now) living statues against it. The loss of my Witch Doctors and leaders hurts more than the rest. As for the living statues, they were as far forward as possible. He had his army lined up in the rear.

I really like Black Hunters, but damn, they are expensive. It's really difficult to base an army around them.

As for Spider Knights, I'm not sure how best to use them. Their web spit is surprisingly effective, so I find that I'm tempted to put them behind my troopers with orders to fire closest. If I do that, though, then I'm putting one of my beefiest combatants in the rear of the battle, when it should probably be at the front.

Originally posted by JJ_Colorado:
Hi,

I saw that battle because I had a scout in the province. The main thing that I noticed is that your arrows were basically ineffective. I recently fought a Machaka opponent who used wind guide (I think) and fire arrows (definitely) to great effect.

I also thought the living statues should have started a little farther forward and your spiders should have held back longer to let the Black Knights use up their lances on the living statues.

But, overall that Ulm army was just completely bad-*ss. I would not have wanted to face it. That army was SCARY. He had a LOT of Master Smiths casting LOTS of bladewinds, and he had over 20 black knights, and he had a lot of other wizards as well.

I think you might have wanted to mass your cavalry on one flank instead of putting part of it on each flank also. It was just bad luck that your black hunters ran straight into his knights.

That Ulm army is the best army in our game FYI. The only army close to it is the main Pythium army.

John

[djtool]

definately begin your machakan career chasing down fire arrows. i suppose if you had a couple of black sorcerers with their earth skill bumped up a notch or two you could combine those fire arrows with earth meld.

another thing you could try (I'm sorry I haven't 'proven' any of this to myself to be certain for you) is buying a ton of the plain ole' warriors and backing them up with mass protection...A N3 sorcerer shouldn't be hard to obtain. You could also have a couple more socerers in your group and back your swarm of warriors with panic spells.

just a couple of ideas

[ June 26, 2004, 13:08: Message edited by: djtool ]

[Graeme Dice]

Another thing to remember is that you have access to both magma eruption and destruction as Machaka. Destruction will remove the armor that makes his troops hard to kill, while magma eruption can kill even through full black plate.

[Schmoe]

It sounds like I don't have enough heavy magic firepower in my armies. I tend to reserve the sorcerers and black sorcerers for rituals and forging, but from everyone's suggestions, maybe I need to include more in my armies. Is that true?

[Huzurdaddi]

You need either mages or serious summons.

It's gotten to that stage in the game. Without either you are going to get beaten every major battle.

I wish I had seen the battle I could give you better advice. Not like I'm the source of all knowledge about this game, that's Norfleet! I kind of suck!

[SelfishGene]

Ive had some experience with Machaka in PBeM, though as it was my first, and after only a couple days of owning the game, probably my least successful .

Ulm is pretty weak to magic. Some ideas:

-Swarm. Cheap, Lasts 2-3 rounds, a good way to soak up enemy fire/lances. Little bugs tend to kill themselves when they get repelled, so it wears itself out quickly.

-Blindness. Not a bad choice against Ulmish Cavalry. Also cheap, easy to research, works well with 80 gold Doctors.

-Fire Archers. For some reason ive never tested fire arrows, even in single player. My comments here would be that Archers are extremely vulnerable to Blade Winds, which Ulm has no trouble casting in large amounts. Even Machakan Hoplites get smacked down hard by Blade Winds.

-Destruction. Earth 3 armor defeating spell. Hard to get unless you have Ainra or a Earth Pretender, and somewhat random in its targeting, esp., if the enemy has spread his formations out.

-Seven Year fever can disease his army if you dispair of killing it outright.