A few general questions about Dominions 2

[Ugrok]

Hello there, ive been playing the dominions 2 demo for the past few days and i must say the game looks very rich.
But i have a few questions concerning the long term playing of this game.

-First of all, is single player worth it? I mean, is the AI challenging for a few months, or, as we often see in strategy games nowadays, is the AI as stupid as a yoghurt?
(I play jotunheim in the demo and i am always losing).
-Is this game as deep as it claims? Maybe i am totally missing the point, but in the demo i just make one big army, conquer as much provinces as i can, then getting beaten by the other gods, then rebuilding a gigantic army, etc...etc... Hmm maybe thats why im always losing.
-How is multiplayer handled? Does everyone play by email, or is it possible to have fast games? Playing 1 turn per day seems boring (but again i havent tried), is it really?

Last question : what is a good province conquering strategy? At the moment i always conquer from my starting province to the adjacent ones, but after ive done it, should i go in one direction, as far as i can (thats what im often doing and it doesnt seem to be a good idea ) or make multiple armies and go in several directions or ... ?


Well, thats a lot of questions, sorry for my terrible english, thanks for reading (and answering ! ) .

[archaeolept]

1. The AI is as useless as most strategy games, but SP can still be fun; especially as a testing ground for nation/pretender setups.

2. It is. Perhaps too deep

3. email games are done, but probably more common is to have a server running the game on quickhost - so, when the last person does his/her turn, the game hosts and it is a new turn. Usually this is done w/ a time limit, ie. if someone hasn't done his turn w/in 24 hrs of the beginning of the turn, it hosts anyways (this would be "24 hr quickhost"). As well, there are blitz games organized through IRC, where either the whole of a small game is played at one sitting (or at least until a suitible endpoint), or else at least all the initial part of a game.

4. There's no answer to that. it depends on your nation and the situation.

[Endoperez]

1.) AI has some patterns that are easy to exploit once you know of them, and it lacks the understanding of more spesific strategy. AI nations mainly utilize big armies of cheap units, while most players use commanders and mages to deal damage and normal or preferably summoned units just as meat shield. There are also few problems with the AI, like the fact that it builds no fortresses.

2.) Yes. As an example, Jotunheim has three themes. When you play against Jotunheim, you might play against
-Iron Woods has not only cheap, stealthy units that might be able to conquer your lowly defended provinces, but cheap mages that are fast researchers and 1/4 of which are cheap bloodhunters. They also have Hags who are powerful in sorcery, and Skrattis who use the blood slaves caught by Vaetti Hags to summon various demons and devils. You can except them to summon multiple Ice Devils, very tough commanders who can kill whole armies singlehandedly if given appopriate equipment. Iron Woods will probably focus on researching Blood magic.
-Utgård has access to Nornas and Seithkonas, the latter of which is one of the most efficient researchers. Unlike Iron Woods, mages of Utgård can be a powerful force on the battlefield. Few Nornas casting Raise Skeletons can overpower independents, especially since half of the undead will be giants. With Alteration, small groups of Giants and Huskarls can be Body Etherealized, which most often allows for victory against much larger forces. Evocation seems to offer little for mages of Death, Nature and Astral, but with Eagle Eyes Nether Bolt can be quite devastating, and Shadow Blast is well worth the gem it costs. But the real carnage begins at Evocation 7, when each of your researching Seithkonas gains the ability to fire 15 armor negating, damage 20 Nether Darts. Just remember that magic resistance negates the damage.
-Niefelheim has no cheap units. No humans, no Vaetti, nothing. And no cheap mages either. But the expensive ones are something spectacular... Niefel Giants are sacred, so high initial magic really pays off. Nature 9 gives the Niefel Giants berserk +4 (or +5?) and Regeneration, and each of water, fire and earth helps even at level of 4 (+2 def, +2 att or reinvigoration 2). Niefel Lords have magics that help them in fight (Quickness, Breath of Winter, and much later Soul Vortex), can forge themselves some very powerful equipment (Wraith Sword) and can also craft cheaper but still effective items (Sword of Quickness, Boots of Quickness, Rime Hauberk). Niefelheim also starts with Illwinter, which could cut down the income of almost all other nations very early in the game in full version. And as Niefelheim players most often have good blessing, the cheap, sacred and skilled Jotun Herses will be even more valuable to them.

That is for one nation with three themes. The themes differ from each other. The strategies they use differ from each other in many ways. The strategies they need to defeat other nations (and their themes) also differ. The game is *deep*.

3.) I have little experience from multiplayer, but one turn per day or four turns per week offers you time to think about your next turn, *and* have a life. Think of it as a built-in safety measure.

4.) It depends, but not only from your nation and situation, but from your playstyle as well. Gandalf Parker, the (mad?) mastermind, has mentioned he might play Caelum (flying nation) and Pangaea (the stealthy nation) by taking weakly defended provinces, building a fort/lab/temple, and going on. I except he conquers the vincinity of each of these "islands" with new units build in there, while continuing to expand all the time. It would probably be awful to play against a nation like that, as independents would be defending his areas, and if you were pushed back, he would have more resources than he started with... He also mentions having been a pain for the player who killed his pretender god and captured his citadel because he was playing Pangaea and had multitude of stealthy forces everywhere.
Most players conquer provinces near capital first, as castles offer supply bonus to provinces near them and it is faster to get reinforcments, but it is possible to do something else as well.

[Zooko]

Jotun woodsmen/scouts are also good sacred troops.

[SurvivalistMerc]

I don't play this game all the time anymore. But I still love it. It has taken the place of Master of Magic (TM) for me.

It is rich in its complexity. And I still have loads of fun against the AI. Some of the folks who post on these forums are really, really good at figuring out AI weaknesses, and there are some...like not building fortresses and building too many independent units and not enough mages. And the entire combat AI (for everyone not just the computer) could use some adjustment so that small units don't distract large groups of ranged units as well as they do now. But the AI offers a challenge even on "Easy."

And an AI that would challenge folks like Endoperez at Dominions 2 would make the game just no fun at all for someone like me who would constantly lose. And a game like this isn't just about learning its internal richness and strategy...it's about having fun, too.

I like losing to the AI once in a while. And I think losing about 1 in 4 games is the "right" AI setting for me. The AI isn't terribly disappointing to me. And if you read some of the game reviews Dominions has received, the AI consistently beat the reviewer on Easy.

As far as multiplayer is concerned, I would recommend that you get to where you can consistently beat the AI on Easy (maybe even Normal) before you try MP. Because otherwise (unless you are playing with players around your own ability) you are likely to find MP a very frustrating experience.

You should buy the full version of the game, though. It is guaranteed to stay on your computer for years to come if you like strategy games (and assuming it doesn't get replaced by Dom 3).

[Ugrok]

Thank you very much for the quick and deep answers. You guys definetely convinced me to buy it.



PS : i didnt see the "themes" you talked about, Endoperez ! I guess they are in the dominiom screen, when you create your pretender? Ill go check.

[Nerfix]

1) The AI is in my mind OK but I dislike it for it's bloodthirsty behavior.


2) The game is deep but a lot of the depth is practicaly unused. Magic and supercombatants make conventional armies unusable really fast. There is certain charm in finding the counters to the supercombatants though. Magic items are dominated by few must-have items. Spell usability varies a lot and many spells that were rarely used in Dom I were made at least situationally usefull in Dom II.

3) Can't really comment here, I've played so little MP and it has been mostly quick LAN and IP games between me and my friends.

4) Depends a lot on what nation you are playing and what your situation is. Big commanders able to take and make punishment who are decked wtih good equipment will generally destroy a lot of smaller units. Something like a Niefel Jarl with Wraith Sword and Horror Helmet with some Niefel Giants as support.

[Gargoyle]

The type of people who go through the trouble of posting to this board are going to be the type of people who can beat most other players as well as the AI of this game.

If you are playing the game from the point of view of good planning, solid strategy, but not using any exploitive or gamey tactics, you should have a fun and competitive experience with the game.

[Endoperez]

Ugrok said:
Thank you very much for the quick and deep answers. You guys definetely convinced me to buy it.

Welcome to addiction!

PS : i didnt see the "themes" you talked about, Endoperez ! I guess they are in the dominiom screen, when you create your pretender? Ill go check.

Yes, they are in the same tab from which you choose your scales and dominion. You can select a theme if your scales meet its requirement (cold 3 for Niefelheim, colder than your preferred temperature as Jotunheim!). If you don't meet the requirements, the theme isn't visible on that view, and you have to select it by first clicking on 'dominion themes' or whatever the subtitle over themes is. That sets your scales to minimum needed for that theme. As you can see, there are some themes all nations can choose from as well as unique ones.

[PashaDawg]

Gargoyle said:
The type of people who go through the trouble of posting to this board are going to be the type of people who can beat most other players as well as the AI of this game.

If you are playing the game from the point of view of good planning, solid strategy, but not using any exploitive or gamey tactics, you should have a fun and competitive experience with the game.

Hey! That's not true! I seem to ALWAYS lose in MP!! But, I still have a great time. I love playing the game and it's fun to interact with the other players... good banter. The constant variety of styles and strategies always impresses me.