munitions carrier crash

[carp]

I'm playing Taiwan v. China, June 1985--me Taiwan, AI=China. I put my Taiwanese HAWKs in the same hex as munitions carriers (trucks). When arty or air hits one of the two vehicles in the hex I get a crash to desktop. I think maybe both are detonating (?????). The only way out is to go back to the last saved game or auto-save and move the truck out of the hex and then let the barrage come in. (Funny how AI arty unspotted can hit a target replay after replay) I can not figure out why the crash other than that. It has happened at least 10 times.

Clues?


carp

[Cameronius]

Have you upgraded to version 2.5? The patch was supposed to fix this bug and I haven't had any problems with it since I upgraded.

[DRG]

carp said:
I'm playing Taiwan v. China, June 1985--me Taiwan, AI=China. I put my Taiwanese HAWKs in the same hex as munitions carriers (trucks). When arty or air hits one of the two vehicles in the hex I get a crash to desktop. I think maybe both are detonating (?????). The only way out is to go back to the last saved game or auto-save and move the truck out of the hex and then let the barrage come in. (Funny how AI arty unspotted can hit a target replay after replay) I can not figure out why the crash other than that. It has happened at least 10 times.

Clues?


carp

The 2.5 patch fixed this bug. It was the very first one on the list to be fixed

1] A bug existed whereby secondary explosions from ammo dump explosions caused crashes . Fixed

As for "(Funny how AI arty unspotted can hit a target replay after replay)" Look........ GIVE IT A REST ! We have repeated over and over and over and over and over and over that the AI does not have an arty targeting cheat. We say this because we **know it** does not. What we DO KNOW is the AI is programmed to target likely areas of deployement AND if you have on map arty or mortars it is quite capable of spotting arty smoke or launch signatures and it WILL make those a priority. It does not repeat NOT have a little cheat code where it peaks at your dipositions and targets your arty or your sams or your HQ's or any one of a number of things that have been destroyed in various peoples games over the years and generated this accusation.

Don

[Mobhack]

Hmm - the ammo supply in the SAME HEX AS his SAMS....

Presumably, the enemy flew some planes in, and so the SAM made launch smoke (targetable) or were actually spotted by the planes (not difficult to do so, either visually, and as the EW goes up, even 1 EW is better than 0).

SAM are prime targets if spotted (as are ammo carriers and HQ) when the AI decides where to deliver its "presents"' It first looks through what it has currently spotted. Those sorts of things go to the top of the list. If the only thing the AI knows about on the map for sure due to a few initial fly-pasts is these SAMS, and nothing else - guess what will get almost 100% of the available arty??. If it noticed the ammo trucks in the same hex, that is a "double whammy" as 2 prime arty-bashing target types are co-located!.

If nothing is spotted, then it will target smoke, or places it had "launch events" (SAM, ATGM etc) from (it knows where you fired from the same as the human does in SP, it knows where you generated travel smoke from in dust conditions as well, in fact we detailed all that in the upgrade text several versions back).

If nothing else is available, it will then decide on generic places to deliver presents. hexes near roads will get shots (so road junctions will get a higher likelihood as several converge), and also it will drop presents near enemy or neutral held victory hexes. Sometimes, it will just deliver presents in the rear 10-15 hex strip as that is where the enemy artillery park tends to be located. Sometimes it will try to do a "road rage" - targetting roads in the centre just on the enemy side, which will be likely approach routes.

NONE of this is "cheating".

So - the OP has probably AI-spotted high-priority SAM sitting still in the same spot, with a metaphorical "kick me!" sign applied, and is so surprised that the AI actually has the sheer gall to drop its little HE presents on this obvious top-priority target?. (What would the OP do if playing PBEM, and his flights revealed enemy human opponent SAM at x1,y1 - ignore them ??).

There is NO cheat code (there was in the original SP1, SP2 and SP3 code, but we REMOVED that on getting the code - we hunted it down and deleted it many years ago.)

If you want SAM to sit in the same spot, they will eventually get spotted and attract fire.
1) Try to get SAM that can be transported, and buy heavy loaders to move them off. (but those can be killed by incoming as well) - so shift them the turn after firing if possible.

2) If not - place them on say rough terrain, so they get less damage. If your ammo transports need to reload them - move them in from afar, load and retire. Try to take a window when the opponent seems to be ignoring the SAM (A human will probably keep shooting till they are toast, the AI may decide something else is worth engaging for a bit). Don't just sit there beside them..

3) IF you need to use immobile ammo dumps to supply immobile SAM, the ammo bunker is best as it is not as much of a pile of combustibles waiting to go boom. But it is more expensive because of the armour.

4) If you need to use the unarmoured ammo dump, remember that it supplies to 2 hexes (at half normal supply). If it goes up then the extra distance may protect the immobile SAM from secondary blast damage. So place that wit a 1 hex gap. It will supply 1-3 SAM rounds usually, so over maybe 2 turns, can resupply a pair of launchers (the lowest numbered first, then the higher).

5) Why put ammo supply in the same hex as the SAM, where there is absolutely no difference in the supply level from 1 hex, but if the ammo truck or dump goes up, the SAM is then sitting in the centre of the initial blast??. Trucks, ammo canister - supply at the same level if in the hex beside the customer as if in the actual hex of the customer. Ammo dump and bunker 2 hexes away will be supplying at about the same level as a truck parked beside the customer.. Parking a unit in the exact same hex as an ammo unit is unnecessary (no extra advantage) - and if it goes up, more detrimental to the customer's health, plus counts the extra point for a unit in the hex when entering if moving.

6) Of course, the best way to do SAM is with mobile launchers supplied by mobile ammo supply (or if SP-SAM are fast enough, by retiring to the fixed ammo dumps, loading, and redeploying). Try not to hang about for maybe > 2 consecutive firing turns firing from the same hex.


Cheers
Andy

[carp]

Thanks, guys. Yes, Don, I know it doesn't cheat on arty. But I've been playing SP since the original in 96-97 and I like having my suspicions. As Andy notes, it can't be in my game play.

And no, I don't have 2.5, but I will have as soon as I hit "send."


danke,

carp

ps: You don't need to respond, but I do miss the old list traffic. I know this is an easier way to store FAQs, but when I used to get all of that email it made me think I was a popular guy. ;-)-~ ~ ~