A Very Simple Question about Abandoned Vehicles

[RightDeve]

I have noticed that there are two benefits of abandoning a vehicle: 1)A very obvious reason, i.e to save your experienced crews, and 2)To save your vehicle from being destroyed by far-away ATGMs, then hopefully to re-enter that same vehicle after the threat subsides

Since the game won't allow any engagements against abandoned vehicles (i.e, you can't place them as targets), my question is; is this definitely a game limitation, OR, there's some philosophy/meaning behind it? What if someone uses it to save his vehicle? (assuming that the enemy won't get near and destroy that vehicle by means of sitting upon it for one full turn, which is the only way to destroy an abandoned vehicle).

RD

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by RightDeve

I have noticed that there are two benefits of abandoning a vehicle: 1)A very obvious reason, i.e to save your experienced crews, and 2)To save your vehicle from being destroyed by far-away ATGMs, then hopefully to re-enter that same vehicle after the threat subsides

Since the game won't allow any engagements against abandoned vehicles (i.e, you can't place them as targets), my question is; is this definitely a game limitation, OR, there's some philosophy/meaning behind it? What if someone uses it to save his vehicle? (assuming that the enemy won't get near and destroy that vehicle by means of sitting upon it for one full turn, which is the only way to destroy an abandoned vehicle).

RD

An abandoned vehicle in the game is merely a decoration. The crew is the unit in which the experience and points reside.

Unless your opponent occupies the same hex as the vehicle (which destroys it), there is nothing he can do to it.

The crew however are another matter entirely - outside the vehicle they are just a small leg unit, subject to the usual HE fire etc.

Basically - deliberately abandoning a vehicle or gun is a bit of a gamey tactic.

A human PBEM player will take advantage of you doing so by mortaring the area to hopefully kill a very expensive crew.

Against the AI, you really don't need to use that sort of advantage - so don't. Simples.

Andy

[iCaMpWiThAWP]

TBH, i don't think anyone would waste expensive ammo in real life, to destroy a vehicle they know that was abandoned, so, sitting a unit there for a turn simulates throwing a satchel inside it to make it useless, at least it sounds like that in my head.
edit: sure you can't always tell if a vehicle was really abandoned just by looking at it...

[RightDeve]

Basically - deliberately abandoning a vehicle or gun is a bit of a gamey tactic.

Yeah, that's the real point I want to ask. Had there's some meaning/philosophy behind this, I think it would be otherwise. Very clear point Mobhack.

TBH, i don't think anyone would waste expensive ammo in real life, to destroy a vehicle they know that was abandoned

Yep, in game terms. But in RL, who knows if a vehicle is abandoned or not (unless there's some people watching it actually abandoned). In RL, it would be safer to at least shoot that vehicle before actually sitting on it and see whether it's abandoned or not, right?

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by RightDeve

Yeah, that's the real point I want to ask. Had there's some meaning/philosophy behind this, I think it would be otherwise. Very clear point Mobhack.

Yep, in game terms. But in RL, who knows if a vehicle is abandoned or not (unless there's some people watching it actually abandoned). In RL, it would be safer to at least shoot that vehicle before actually sitting on it and see whether it's abandoned or not, right?

In RL, abandoned vehicles attract fire - especially from the fly boys.

My copy of the report on the Normandy air support mentioned one abandoned German half-track left on an obvious point on a hill. Examination of the various traces left by weaponry showed about 20 or more different attack runs had been performed on it, with bombs, guns of different calibres, rockets etc. So it had probably been reported as 20 different "kills" by various flights/squadrons over a week or so's time frame.

But down on the ground, beaten-up status or simple "neglected" state is easy to verify.

However from game code PV, that sort of thing is simply impossible to properly code.

Andy

[RightDeve]

Ok, thanks for that information.

Another question: When will it not be gamey to actually abandon a vehicle? Is the gamey factor when you have in mind to reoccupy that vehicle again?

Sorry it sounds dumb, but that sort of thing is a kind of thin red line between cheating & doing it right.

[Suhiir]

Originally Posted by Mobhack

In RL, abandoned vehicles attract fire - especially from the fly boys.

My copy of the report on the Normandy air support mentioned one abandoned German half-track left on an obvious point on a hill. Examination of the various traces left by weaponry showed about 20 or more different attack runs had been performed on it, with bombs, guns of different calibres, rockets etc. So it had probably been reported as 20 different "kills" by various flights/squadrons over a week or so's time frame.

Andy

I saw the same thing during Gulf I.
I recall one T-62 in particular that had been hit AT LEAST five times by various air delivered weapons (and no doubt reported as 10 kills by the Air Farce) and once by the ground forces as they moved up.

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by RightDeve

Ok, thanks for that information.

Another question: When will it not be gamey to actually abandon a vehicle? Is the gamey factor when you have in mind to reoccupy that vehicle again?

Sorry it sounds dumb, but that sort of thing is a kind of thin red line between cheating & doing it right.

You would deliberately abandon a vehicle in order to save the crew's built-up and valuable experience in a campaign. So, probably only core troops left in a vulnerable position (e.g. with no main gun left and about to be swarmed or slotted).

The only non-gamey time to abandon with a view to reoccupying a vehicle is scouting. Drive a scout car up behind a hill or tree line. Stop. Next turn, get the crew out to do a foot recce on the ridge, tree line or from a building (to save crashing into it). A crew is less obvious than a vehicle for the enemy to spot. And if the scout vehicle carries leg dismounts then not needed.

Andy

[cbreedon]

Is there a hot key for the abandon function? Did this just come out in the latest release?

[Mobhack]

Originally Posted by cbreedon

Is there a hot key for the abandon function? Did this just come out in the latest release?

In the game, press the Help button (?) or the "?" hot key for a list of the hot keys, and other quick reference help. (You may need to select GAME help, if you are e.g. currently in the deployment phase).

You want the paragraph describing the "@" hot key.

This function has been in since the MS-DOS version, ie >5+ years ago. (Looking through the release history in the G/G does not mention it as far as I can see anyway).

Andy