My AI Design Q&A

[Master Belisarius]

Originally posted by JLS:
I also have learnt a lot from MB, the Master with the AI.

Hey, thanks! But I just have learned from Mephisto, Alpha Kodiak, Atraikius and Rollo... Think they're more creative than me and the true "Masters".

Originally posted by JLS:
Boarding, not just right for the AI yet.
Kamikazi and Troop Assaults, work for the AI with awesome results

Yep, but I saw the Colony ships of the Vikings board ships... and explode!
But consider that these kind of ships can be used for other purposes as auxiliary ships.

Originally posted by JLS:
The AI does not sweep the correct minefield at the at the correct time, anyway.

In my view, at least the AI does a decent job (I think!).

Originally posted by JLS:
Yes, try to have Ship and Fleet Training Facility with your Supply Generation. Or just for SY Colonies. Military and Construction Colonies may be a resupply base if you have a SY present.

Agree with you... but still will be by chance.

Originally posted by JLS:
(1) Why would you want the AI to invest the Resources for a cloaking BSY, as opposed to a shield and PD?

Good question. My oppinon is that the Armor Cloak is good because give the bonus and a little protection while cloaked. Anwyay, a lone space shipyard usually is dead meat...

Originally posted by JLS:
(2) With the same name for example (Attack Ship) , the AI usually will pick the upper Designs best and largest design to build..

Think he was talking about the rotation between designs, that at some point the AI start to do (even using the same name!).

Originally posted by JLS:
(3) Sounds like one for the Experts like MB, Mephisto, Tampa Bay Gamer and Forum Moderators .
As I recall, the AI ship hangs around for a short time if cannot Retrofit, plus the AI gets a neat little message it can't read
I will test this, and get back to you on this if know one replys

Agree with you.

Originally posted by JLS:
(4) Use the armor Armor Spaces Per One := xxxx in the design file. (for normal Armor)

Agree... but the AI will try to use the "best" available Armor (it mean, Scattered Armor if have the tech and the space).

Originally posted by JLS:
Inregards to Colonizers, I listen to MB's advise. Actually take all the advise form all the Players, but the Experts I mentioned above, will have the answers. [/QB]

Hug, thanks! But really think that we're most the time blind, and the trial/error and exchange experiences, are the only way to find most of the answers...

[cybersol]

Originally posted by JLS:
Cybersol, how is it my Last edit was
June 12, 2003, 00:51: Message edited by: JLS'

And you have something different then my final post?

Your post 'posted June 12, 2003 01:28'

You made me think and go test things so much that I started to post before your edit, but finished afterwards.

Originally posted by JLS:
So would you say, if the AI does not install cloaking, do you think, Cybersol, the AI does a sufficient job, Sweeping mines for the Main AI Fleets.

The AI settings for Base se4 are Ships don't move through minefields := false
Will this not yield ship after ship, sacrificing itself until the Minefield is empty?

The AI minesweeping is defenitely not optimal, but it is somewhat sufficient. Case in point, A pair of AI's facing off don't remain sealed off from each other forever. The way the AI uses the "mine sweeper" class ship, think of it as a lone kamikaze ship aimed at the nearest marked mine field. Not ideal, but it works with enough of them. Add additional minesweepers (in place of boarding or kamikaze) that will join fleets and the result appears adequate, though far from optimal.

I use true for ships don't move through minefields, but unmodded hulls don't have minesweeping capability like in AIC

[Master Belisarius]

[quote]Originally posted by cybersol:

The way the AI uses the "mine sweeper" class ship, think of it as a lone kamikaze ship aimed at the nearest marked mine field. Not ideal, but it works with enough of them. Add additional minesweepers (in place of boarding or kamikaze) that will join fleets and the result appears adequate, though far from optimal.

I use true for ships don't move through minefields, but unmodded hulls don't have minesweeping capability like in AIC

This is exactly my approach... and the approach of most of the "modern" modders.

[JLS]

bumped

[ June 12, 2003, 03:49: Message edited by: JLS ]

[cybersol]

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
From scratch??
It's something against my principles, I thought. Never started a Cobol program or an AI from zero!!!!

Yeah, it seemed like a good idea when I started, but it takes longer than you would think. At least it forces me to learn about and make a decision on everything. So far I'm just focusing on the bussiness end of the AI, not the political or speech, etc.

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
A cloaked ship can't build anything... but as you noted in your second post, I think the best use for these ships is try to recover damaged ships that can't move...
I dislike when the space yard ship build something... usually they build Defense bases in middle of nowhere, or build colony ships and send those ships to colonize planets without load population first (and then the new colony will be useless for the AI!).

Well that explains why you cloak them. I'm implementing space yard ships now, so I have not tested them. My impression from previous Posts is that they are supposed to go to a front line resupply base and construct from there. If they indeed build lots of stuff in the middle of nowhere then I will have to cloak them or not build them as well.

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
I only saw this behavior when an AI reach the DN, but maybe the trigger is that after some time without redesign a ship, the AI decide to redesign using the previous ship design with different weapon...

It works better now that I call the destroyer and lower "light attack ship" and the light cruisers to battle cruisers "main attack ship". I hope it doesn't decided to produce more light attack ships later in the game though. CSM1 destroyers versus dreadnaughts would be amusing but not effective.

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
The problem is that considering the free space, the AI will try to use the most advanced Armor...

Conclusion: if you want to use a ship with lot of Standard Armors (not Scattering!), you should not research After Armor III!

Yeah, I reached that conclusion also. If the armor were give an ability like "normal armor" and that could be called in the misc section that would work SO much better. Alas that requires modding though.

Originally posted by Master Belisarius:
I think the AI always check the 1-11 every turn. My guess is that the AI always start from the number 1 in the queue and check if need to build the item or not. One after other.
For this, if the queue is very large, the AI have problems to reach the Lastest items in the queue... because always is building trying to replace the loses in the first places of the queue.

AI_CONSTRUCTION_VEHICLES.TXT. This is a really interesting inquiry, and might deserve its own thread, but it would be all you guys anyway.

MB, what you describe is what I though at first also. AI_Research and AI_Planet_Types definitely work the way you describe, but they don't loop and are not numbered. I will have to test this out some more, because as you say it determines optimal queue length and behaivor.

[JLS]

AI Kamikaze Mine Sweeper

This is indeed, may be the only current approach for base se4.

How may ships would you expect to be in your fleet?
How many fleets do you expect your AI to make by turn 400?

Kami mine Sweepers, what hull would you say would be appropriate and how many Mine Sweeping Components would be installed on a good Kami Mine Sweeper?

How many Kami Mine Sweepers would you expect to be Sufficient for one AI fleet?

How many AI Kami Mine Sweepers in Total, do you think would be required for all your AI Fleets?

Please, do not consider AI vs AI, but consider a good Human Player will have a Solid 100 Mine field probably back to back, for your AI to over come.

[ June 12, 2003, 04:12: Message edited by: JLS ]

[JLS]

Bump

Originally posted by cybersol:
The AI minesweeping is defenitely not optimal, but it is somewhat sufficient. Case in point, A pair of AI's facing off don't remain sealed off from each other forever. The way the AI uses the "mine sweeper" class ship, think of it as a lone kamikaze ship aimed at the nearest marked mine field. Not ideal, but it works with enough of them. Add additional minesweepers (in place of boarding or kamikaze) that will join fleets and the result appears adequate, though far from optimal.

I use true for ships don't move through minefields

What if, the AI Player (1) had minefield that was marked belonging to Player (2) from first contact. Player (2) is 3 Systems away and a treaty is signed between the (1) and (2). Before AI Player (1) cleared Players (2) Minefield that is 3 Systems away from AI (1)players HW.

Now AI Player (1) makes first contact with Player (3) Minefield; about 15 turns after AI Players (1) agreement with Player (2), 6 Systems away from Players (1) Home World. AI player (1) and (3) almost immediately have hostilities.

With this scenario how do you think, AI player (1) will use his Mine Sweepers...

Please, no whos on first

[ June 15, 2003, 19:28: Message edited by: JLS ]