Building New Planets

[Nyx]

Thanks, I'm interested to see if this works. But won't it cost more than building them normally? Sure you only pay 80% at each step, but you pay 80% several times. Even if you only retrofit once you're paying 50% (original design that gets upgraded)+ 80%(cost of SB with cable or plate) = 130% total. Add in all the extra steps and it appears a lot more expensive. Very fast, but very expensive.

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[rdouglass]

I've been building 'em the 'old fashioned' way. I guess I'm ignorant, but I still don't quite see how you get the Star Bases retrofitted / configured with components that don't violate the "50% upgrade" rule. Do you possibly have a design file that has those bases in it? I would be extremely curious to see it (or parts of it). Maybe just a more detailed list of your previous post - I'm still confused as to your component lists...

As to others, I like building RW's and SW's and do think they are important. They can be a gamebreaker (I would think) ina Human vs Human game. There are other ways of making RW's interesting....

I am currently playing a game now where I have a system with 3 RW's - 2 are steadily building Monolith facilities and are at over 50K of each resource output. The 3rd is filled with Research and Intel fac's. Once I got them built, I gave everything else away (more or less evenly) to all the remaining AI's execpt for 6 Baseships. Then I declared war on all of 'em.

It's been fun fighting my own designs AND theirs as well as trying to recapture all the "strongholds" I had built before. It kept my fleets together (25 plus fleets avg 20 ships each) and attaked me a lot. It makes for a pretty good "scenario". The only downfall is I know all the systems and designs (which are also my own). You guys ought to try it....

EDIT... I forgot to mention that I also gave away 3 RW's. I can't wait to get to them and find out what the AI did with 'em...

[This message has been edited by rdouglass (edited 20 February 2001).]

[geoschmo]

quote:

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Thanks, I'm interested to see if this works. But won't it cost more than building them normally? Sure you only pay 80% at each step, but you pay 80% several times. Even if you only retrofit once you're paying 50% (original design that gets upgraded)+ 80%(cost of SB with cable or plate) = 130% total. Add in all the extra steps and it appears a lot more expensive. Very fast, but very expensive.

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Nyx, where are you getting the 50% in your figuring here.

When I read Alaysr's post the first thing I thought was what you thought, fast, but more expensive. But I checked out his math and it is correct. Each time you retrofit you only pay 80% of the DIFFERENCE between the two designs. In other words, the sum of all your steps is less than the total would be.

Also, a SB is big enough to hold a ringworld component and a repair bay, but not a Space yard. Keep in mind that the actual work of the retrofit can be done by a repair bay, but you have to have a space yard present to start it. You could design your early steps with space yards and repair bays and not take the space yard out until the Last step. That would work.

Keen insight Alasyr, or Drake or whoever noticed the 80% thing. I had been going on the asumption that retrofit was more expensive than that. Had never bothered to test it before.

Geo

[Hydraa]

With master computers you can fit the spaceyard and ringworld comp on the SB.

On mine I set up a progression of ships to use refit. I set up all of my progressions with the spaceyard. That way it can keep building a new SB while it is being retrofitted itself.

I used the same basic bases and decide at the end if it was becoming a plate or cable at step 6 or to go to step 8 to become a RW component.

I also noticed that you can build the ringworld with all Stellar manip components destroyed. However for the contest I waited the turn to let them be repaired.

[alasyr]

I took a look at retrofit number for smaller ships and from the retrofit cost is seems that adding new item in design cost 75% (number that Drake suggested was 70%) and removing item from desingn cost 10% of item value.For retrofit you pay max.
10% of 2/3 value of a new design (it's actually value of current design) and 75% of 1/3 of a new design (difference in resources between designs) resulting in 6.66%+25%=31.66% of a new design which is by 1/3 (33.33%) richer in resources than design it derivates from.So in worst case you save 1.66%.

[alasyr]

Well it seems that retrofit cost for new component in setting.txt is 70%.But retrofit than must be affected with some racial characteristics.Two of those come to my mind Repair and Mantenance.Repair is my bet because I had that at 50% now and it seems that for every 10% decrease retrofit cost goes up 5%.Maintenace does not seem valid candidate because my race have 90% plus 2% for engineers.This suggest a possibility that with an increase in repair (over 100%) retrofit might be cheaper.Also I think tha repair affect the number of components repaired by repair bays and SYs in a way that actual number of repairs per turn is percent of nominal number of comp. repairable, percent being repair value.

[alasyr]

RDouglass

The basic idea is to make all designs with space yard or repair bay component as components need to be repaired afterward.For the design of first base is important that it has as balanced resources as possible.The more balaced those less time is needed to build them as they reach required value faster.The good components for this design are viruses (500 Min., 500 Rad.) and organic armor (70-130 Org).
For other designs you can just fill them with master computers (4000 Min, 1000 Org and 1000 Rad) and/or wiruses (500 Min, 500 Rad) or any other component with high (total resouces)/size ratio taking out components from previous design when you need more space.


[This message has been edited by alasyr (edited 21 February 2001).]