A long road

[Gloo]

First a reminder: one movement point in the game (i.e. one hex per turn, one speed point) equals roughly 3 (three) km/h or 2 mph. Take that into account when calculating game speeds.

Thanks a lot for the info but, how do you think I calculated the speed previously? It seemed so unbelievable to see a M1 firing and reloading while driving at 36km/h off road that I thought the ancient data used by SP2 (1 turn=150-180') was still used here! This gave a M1 12-14km/h off road capabilities, which was almost acceptable (considering this unit can fire while moving at 15km/h). I was wrong and it's actually 60 seconds per turn!

20 is a decent road speed for a modern tanks...

I agree but it means 10 for off road capabilities and that's WAY to much for moving AND firing, except for the AMX Leclerc.

Also keep in mind that not all OOBs have been created by the same people, so for two different countries, you may have two totally different sets of standards.

Do you mean that the data aren't checked against each other between the different OoBs? I don't think that's possible!

Not to mention people's national pride kicking in from time to time.

I see what you mean but there's no national pride here, just raw and unquestionable data, widely accepted and verified (even though there's always a margin between the values presented). The M1 is unable to fire and reload while driving off road at 36km/h. The Leclerc is -as far as I know, so don't hesitate to correct me if I'm wrong- the only MBT worldwide able to do this. Not even to mention the accuracy factor. No pride or "I have the biggest one" syndrome here.

Now that you mention it, the Leclerc and M1A2 should have broadly the same values.

I'm talking about the M1 which, according to the game was brought into action in 1980, and the Leclerc first generation, which was first issued to a real unit (the 6-12 RC, the one who's been recently sent to South Lebanon with the FINUL) in July 1994 (not in January 1992 as the game says), not the M1A2! The M1A2 is using a 120mm gun while the M1 used the 105mm M68A1, based on the English L7 tube, the same that was equipping the M60... .

Maybe the Leclerc's FCS is slightly more sophisticated (at least the Series 2 , but I wouldn't bet on it)...

When it comes to moving and firing simultaneously -and that's my only concern here- I don't thinks there's even the slightest point to compare the two vehicles. The General Dynamics FC system of the latest versions of M1A2 are probably as good as the one equipping the Leclerc but they remain with manually loaded tubes. I suppose that's a concern in the US army staff. Maybe that's the kind of reasons leading them to evaluate the possibilities of guided shells, as the MRM CE... while this kind of systems were previously despised for almost 40 years.

but it is also reported to be largely less user-friendly, so chances are you could give it a slightly lower value for the same crew experience.

That's an interesting info; could you quote your source for that please? I would rather have increased the experience value for the US crews (a priori they are more battle tested than any french MBT crew) so it seems more than fair to do that. But regarding the "largely reported less user-friendly" aspect of the vehicle I haven't heard about that until now.