Polish OOB 5.5

[Pibwl]

Going deeper:

024 BRDM-2 Malutka2,
033 BRDM-2 Malutka - this should be the same vehicle, firing 9M14P Malutka-P missiles (#155), named "BRDM-2 Malutka", or better "BRDM2 Malutka-P" (vehicle's designation was 9P133). Poland didn't use early 9P122 BRDM-2 with 9M14M Malutka missiles, but it uses Malutka-P from early 70s. It carries 14 missiles (now: 12) according to Polish MoD page and Russian sources (as unit 383 in Russian oob).

There are two units currently, 033 in 1/70-12/104 with wrong armament (ordinary Malutka #145) and vision=0 and 024 in 1/100-12/120 with correct armament and vision=20. One vehicle would be enough IMO, because as far as it is known, they weren't modernized in any way. Besides, in 2000 it was an obsolete system and wouldn't be modernized at that time. Vision=0 is correct (a soldier at one forum wrote, that it was good vehicles, but "blind as a mole" at night). Missiles could be fired and guided at night, but a target had to be noticeable in sights.

I have no precise start date ("early 70s"), but according to an article in Tekhnika i Vooruzhenie 10/2000 (http://vadimvswar.narod.ru/ALL_OUT/T...R/PturR010.htm ), despite it was commissioned in the USSR in 1969, but first 17 were produced only in 1971, and bigger production ran from mid-72. Therefore, a realistic date in Poland would be 1/73.

By the way: unit 384 BRDM-2 MalutkaP in Russian OOB might need change of date at least to 1971 (now: 1/69) and from 10 to 14 missiles (according to a quoted page, 14 was standard, but even 18 missiles could be carried in overload).

One of these Polish units could be replaced with a new unit BRDM-1 Malutka, or just BRDM Malutka (9P110 vehicle) - used in limited number (radio code 1). Details are lacking, but it must have been used from around 1968 until around 1980 (commissioned in the USSR in 1963). Data like unit 382 in Russian oob, but according to a quoted page, it also carried 14 missiles (6 + 8 reloads). A proper icon is 2331 (though it would be worth to erase lines suggesting open hatches in rear part - it had elevating hatch. Here are some photos http://cris9.narod.ru/rva_9p110.htm


025 SU-100 - apparently weren't used in Poland in any significant number. In 1949 there existed only two "pattern vehicles" [Poligon 3/2010]. In 1955, a total number of 51 SU-85 and SU-100 is given, what corresponds with 50 SU-85 and 2 SU-100 in 1949 [same source]. In 1960 there are mentioned only 43 SU-85. Despite Magnuski in his book (from 1984) wrote in general, that 2 were acquired in 1945 and "bigger numbers of SU-100" were bought in late 40s and 50s, but he didn't give any details, and it is doubtful in a view of numbers above, from newer sources. There is no information on further import of SU-100, only of heavy SP-guns and SU-76s. So, it should have radio code 3 at best (if not be removed).

027 JSU-152 - correct name is ISU-152. Extinct from inventory before 1960 [Poligon 3/2010] (say, 1959 - now: 12/65). It didn't typically use Heat ammo - at least half of them should be AP.

029 ASU-85 - according to J. Magnuski, they were used during manoeuvres in 1963 and withdrawn some time before 1983 (say, 12/80 - now: 1/66-12/86). Needs date change of formation 14 as last unit.

For information: gun's designation in ASU-85 was D-70 (it could be changed, since Poland doesn't use D-48 gun in other applications).

030 BRDM-1 Trzmiel - could be named just BRDM Trzmiel (2P27 vehicle). They were withdrawn by 1989 (now: 12/94).

According to Russian sources (among others Shirokorad's article http://vadimvswar.narod.ru/ALL_OUT/T...R/PturR003.htm ) they carried only 6 missiles (3 + 3 reloads - now: 8 - for all countries). Proper pic is 29057 - for BRDM-1 Shmel in all countries (current one 11031 is 2P32 Falanga). I've also found correct icon with 3 missiles: 2945 (though it would be worth to erase a rear line, suggesting open hatch - it had two-part hatch, opening to sides, unlike BRDM-1 with Falanga missiles, same for 2946 desert one).

031 BRDM-1 Falanga - should be removed - Poland never used BRDMs with Falanga missiles (unless somebody finds a source). According to Russian sources, there's no sign of their export at all.

032 BRDM-2 Fal.-M1 - should be removed (as 031)

034 BRDM-2 Konkurs (9P148 Konkurs) - used from 1984 only (now: 1/79) [Technika Wojska Polskiego - Polish Military Equipment - semi-official MoD 1998 book]. Rare piece of equipment - radio code should be 1. Correct icon is 2342 or 2324.

According to all Russian sources and Polish MoD page, it carries 15 missiles Konkurs (for all countries). Its weapons is overstated - it should be replaced in the file with standard 9M113 Konkurs (like weapon 166 from Russian oob), instead of 9M113M KonkursM with more penetration (not used in Poland) [same book].

035 MT-LB/82, 036 2S12 SPM - should be removed, with corresponding formations 16, 37, 238 - Poland never used SP-mortars. First such vehicles are planned on Rosomak APC chassis, but don't exist as for now.

037 Krab - as for now, only 2 prototypes and 1 serial vehicle are used. It should be given radio 3 in fact in that period (now: from 1/107). The program has been postponed for years, probably by 2013 there will be 6 more built at last.

038 2S7 Piwonia - more proper name is original 2S7 Pion (in all publications, among others in semi-official Technika Wojska Polskiego. "Piwonia" is a Polish translation of flower name, not used in practice). Used from 1986 until spring of 2006 [Poligon nr 06/2009] (now: 1/87-12/120). Very rare piece of equipment (8 pieces). Crew was 7 (probably for all countries). I don't know if it's good idea, but the crew had RPG-7 and AK rifles as a standard for self-defence.

039 2S1 Gozdzik - they have no AAMG.

Regards
Michal

[Pibwl]

AA systems (beginning):

040 Loara SPAAG - still there exist only 1 or 2 vehicles... very rare, though might be used in combat. Radio code should be 3 - it rather won't be numerous by 2020. It should have some SD (now:0 - it has 12 tubes). Speed is officially given as 60 km/h (now: 23). Date is OK.

041 BTR-40A - there's no evidence, that this variant was used in Poland (not a mention in Magnuski's book, nor a photo of a Polish vehicle). Personally, I'd remove it. At least its availability should be limited to 1955-1979 (BTR-40 were bought in 1955, for sure they weren't used since the 1980s) (now: 1/53-12/105).
Needs change of formations nos 4, 18 - earliest unit should be #042

Speaking of SPAA guns:
415 GAZ-AAMG - there's no sign of such vehicles, nor quadruple Maxims used in Poland. Personally, I'd remove it. Its weapon would be also useless.

It might be replaced with new unit M17 - variant of US M16 MGMC shipped to the USSR. Not a common vehicle, though - some 16 were left after the war. The question is, how long they were combat worthy, and how much ammo they had. I'd say, some 1949, maximum 1952 would be a good ending date. It is known, that they were used until late 50s, but in a pure APC role.
It would need separate formations, with a gap before unit 042.

By the way: #399 ZSU M-16 in the Russian OOB should be in fact renamed M-17, since original M-16s weren't shipped to the USSR.

042 ZSU-57-2 - date 1/59 is OK

043 ZSU-23-4 Szylka - still used, probably until 1/115 at least (now: 12/105) (start 1/68 is OK)

044 SA-8a Gecko - proper name is Osa-AK. It should have 6 missiles (now 4). Used from 1980 only [Polish Military Equipment] until 1/120 (now: 1/76-12/110) (according to other sources, used even from 1981 or 1984). Icon should be 1849 - it was a variant with 6 containers.

045 SA-9 Gaskin - should be named Strzala-1 (or Strela-1 - Soviet name) or 9K31 Strzala-1. Used until some 1997 at best - not present in Polish Military Equipment book from 1998 (now: 12/104).

046 SA-13 Gopher - should be named Strzala-10M (or Soviet name Strela-10M). Used from 1982 [Pol.Mil.Equip.] (1/80) (according to other sources, even from 1988). Should be very rare - only 4 vehicles used. According to Raport 6/2000, they were to be withdrawn in 2000 (now 12/104).

047 SA-2 Guideline - proper name is SA-75 Dwina (or Soviet SA-75 Dvina). Used from 9/1959 - http://infowsparcie.net/wria/o_autor...75wolchow.html (first 2) - more realistic date 1/60 (now 1/57 - their production was only starting in 1957 in USSR).
Needs change of formation 20, as the earliest unit.

048 SA-3 Goa - proper name is S-125 Newa. Introduced in 1969 (1 for training) or 1970 (operational) - http://infowsparcie.net/wria/o_autorze/pzr_s125m.html (now 1/63). Initially twin launchers were used only (until late 1970s).

Quadruple launchers appeared with S-125M Newa, from mid-70s only (probably 1973 - same source) - there should be made two units. Initial twin launchers and quadruple from mid-70s concern all countries - S-125M was commissioned in the USSR in 1971.

049 SA-4 Ganef - proper name is 2K11 Krug. Date is OK.

050 SA-6 Gainful - proper name is 2K12 Kub. Used from 1974 only (now 1/73) - http://infowsparcie.net/wria/o_autor...ata_59_85.html

...

060 SA-13 Strela-10 - to be removed - they were withdrawn before 2005 [Raport 6/2000] (now 1/105) - see unit #46

061 SA-2 Guideline - proper name of later variant is S-75M Wolchow. Used from 1964 [http://infowsparcie.net/wria/o_autorze/eksport_pzr.html and Polish Military Equipment] (now 1/84) until 2001 (now 1/97).
The only difference from the unit 047 is better radar 110, but Russian S-75 Volkhov, available from 1/62, has 105. In fact, it should have more improvements over SA-75, but I'm not going to twiddle with it, at least this year...

...

074, 076 SA-5 Gammon - proper name is S-200 Wega (or Russian Vega). Very rare - only two units near the seaside (maybe radio code 3). Delivered in late 86, operational from 1987 (http://infowsparcie.net/wria/o_autor...ata_59_85.html - now 1/86)

Regards,
Michal